[OCCAID] RE: [SPAM] Occaid Digest, Vol 19, Issue 10

[Chris Johnson]

On Sat, 8 Jan 2005 18:18:31 -0600 
"Cook, Timothy C." <TCCOOK at stthomas.edu> wrote:

> 
> Message: 5
> Date: Sat, 8 Jan 2005 02:34:45 -0500
> From: "Scott J. Clifford" <clifford at cnacs.occaid.org>
> Subject: Re: [OCCAID] Proposal for EINTAP
> To: Tristan Santore <titan at titaniumz.com>
> Cc: occaid <occaid at cnacs.occaid.org>
> Message-ID: <20050108073445.GA81606 at scylla.towardex.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
> On Sat, Jan 08, 2005 at 06:55:53AM +0000, Tristan Santore wrote:
> > >
> > Hi everybody,
> > 
> > ater doing some testing with spamcalc I must strongly say that I fully 
> > agree with Miles oppinion on that issue. I do use a longer hostname 
> > myself...and yes i do use it on irc, which is prolly the main reason why 
> > people use hostnames like e.g. my.oppinion.is.me.uk could be one. Which 
> > is classed as dns spam. Saying that though i do not use ridiculous dns 
> > names. But in my oppinion I dont see how people would be bothered by a 
> > longer than usual dns name. I mean you would not see that dns name 
> > unless u were looking at peoples hostmasks. Also I dont see that the 
> > overhead would be that much higher, but please correct me if I am wrong. 
> > Its a bit odd how it decides on if something is dns spam or not anyway.
> > 
> > Only a short while ago governments in Europe were discussing (still are) 
> > if isp's should keep logs of peoples surfing habits, so that these could 
> > be used for criminal investigations etc.
> > 
> > Lets ask ourselves, if we start to regulate the internet in certain 
> > ways, wont we destroy the whole idea of it ? People are not causing a 
> > nuisance really by using a longer dns name. People who exploit ipv6 and 
> > their tunnel for DOS attacks or other malicious activity deserve to be 
> > disciplined, because they are actively causing a nuisance and more work 
> > for others.
> > 
> > You are missing a point though. There is a difference between transit
> > traffic and what goes on an address space that represents OCCAID project
> > in front of the public.
> > You can feel free to host porn and dirty stuff through our network so
> > long as you keep such services out of our address space. Feel free to
> > get a /48 from BTExact, HE or whomever, run disgusting stuff and send
> > bits to OCCAID for all we care. well of course, we will act if there
> > is illegal traffic flowing since that's requirement by the law.
> > 
> > But if you were to do the same out of address space that represents
> > OCCAID, it makes us nothing but look like bunch of children. OCCAID
> > is also planning to register as a 501(c)3 non profit corporation
> > this year sometime. How do you think we can expect companies and
> > businesses to continue to donate to the project when there are
> > bunch of seven year olds comparing how much longer they can piss
> > using address space which represents us in the public?
> > 
> > Oh don't get me wrong, I agree to your points. I hate internet
> > censorship myself. But do note the difference between 
> > guilty-by-association versus transit traffic. 
> > 
> > 
> > Scott.
> > 
> > ------------------------------
> 
> 
> I would first like to point out that at this time I haven't even set up any
> rdns so however this turns out really has no affect on me at all.  So I
> guess I feel like I can approach this with at least a semi-impartial
> opinion.  That being said, I think that this reasoning is bs.
> 
> How many donating corporations sit on IRC all day and dns, then trace the
> source of the IP block of any person they see with a hostname they dislike?
> I really really really don't think that's going to be a reason for anyone
> who would normally donate not to.  And if it is I think they need a nice
> reality check if they base occaid solely on some of it's end users.  Are you
> going to not donate to tsunami victims in asia because some of the people
> handing out aid are known terrorists?  To be quite honest, I don't think
> annoying hostnames represent "kiddies" being on the network period.  I
> *REALLY* hope that any donating member wouldn't pull their donations because
> of what a few of the end users of the project are doing with their address
> space.  If it's not hurting the network, who cares?  I would think they'd be
> more inclined to pull funding knowing that you were putting restrictions on
> it's use which in my mind makes it less of an "educational" network.
> There's already a policy in place that removes any user who's taking
> extensive DOS attacks... I think that in and of itself solves the entire
> problem of it becoming a "kiddie" network.
> 
>   I can whois and paste you a dozen different "kiddies" on IRC right now who
> would all fly well below spamcalc, which is just one more reason I think
> that the reasoning of this preventing "kiddies" from joining up is BS.  And
> in all reality, any "kiddie" who would use some rediculously long and
> annoying hostname probably wouldn't know the fist thing about setting up
> BIND anyways, so it doesn't really matter.
> 
> Spamcalc in and of itself is flawed, hell, one of the occaid bots scores a
> 73... "jeeps.are.wacky.ws".  Regardless, I really don't see any benefit to
> the project, and I *REALLY* don't see it keeping kiddies out.  Sounds like
> someone's personal vendetta more than anything to me because that reasoning
> just doesn't hold water.  Anyways, just adding my 2c, and as I said, it
> really doesn't affect me one way or the other.  Hopefully I didn't make
> anyone too upset :)  Keep up the good work guys.  Hopefully I have my
> thoughts collected into an understandable format as I'm kind of in a hurry.

First off did you even bother to notice that "jeeps.wacky.ws" is _not_ on occaid ip space not to mention it is not ipv6 connected. If you took the time you would realize that "jeeps.are.wacky.ws has address 69.31.71.225". Although that client might be in the "unoffical occaid channel" which by the way if you read the channel rules has nothing to do with occaid whatsoever besides a place for occaid members or anyone who cares to join and talk about anything at random. What people do with there own ip space is up to them, what we are talking about here is occaid ip space. If you want to create crazy dns spam then get your own ip space or get it from a provider that doesnt care what you are doing with it. I honestly dont think this whole dns spam issue is as big as alot of people have been making it out to be. It has already wasted too many peoples time be replying and reading all of these emails regaring it.

> 
> Tim
> 


-- 
Christopher Johnson - <wacky at wacky.ws>